80 - Salary Negotiation and Raises with Katy McFee
Salary Negotiation and Raises with Katy McFee

80 – Salary Negotiation and Raises with Katy McFee

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Katy McFee spent 18 years working in sales and leadership, doing lots of salary negotiation on both sides of the table. She recently left her EVP, Sales job to start a coaching and consulting business focused on helping more women become executives and transition successfully to leadership positions. In this episode, we talk all about salary negotiation and how to ask for a raise in your new work environment. 

Listen to the episode in the podcast player below, or find it on Apple Podcast or Spotify.

Salary Negotiation and Raise with Katy Mcfee Transcript

Daphne Gomez:
Hi, Katy. Thank you so much for being here.

Katy McFee:
Thank you for having me.

Daphne Gomez:
Katie, you and I connected on LinkedIn, one of my favorite places to meet people. Because you were giving great advice for people on salary negotiating, and I started to lurk on your LinkedIn and it was very impressive, and I thought that you were going who be a great person to bring onto the podcast. Usually, I have people who are working in the EdTech space, people who are bringing information about their own story of being a former teacher. And you are not a former teacher, but you have climbed the corporate ladder, and I’d love for you to introduce yourself to this audience, to learn a little bit about you and your expertise in this market.

Katy McFee:
Yeah, sure. I spent 18 years of my career in biotech and tech, primarily in sales and then in leadership, so lots of negotiation, with customers, with my bosses, and then eventually, with my teams as I moved into leadership. And then more recently, I just moved out of that. I eventually worked my way up to an EVP, Sales role. And then recently, I decided to leave that altogether and start my own business, which is all centered around helping more women to get to leadership levels and to transition successfully into those positions. So, lots of negotiation in my past, and I was happy to be able to help some women on LinkedIn.

Katy McFee:
I was actually just feeling a little bit fiery that day. I wasn’t planning to post on that. And something happened that just… That made me think about how women just don’t negotiate to the same level that men do. And so, I just rapid fired at that post and it ended up getting quite a lot of views. A lot of women connected with me. And so, I saw this as a big need that needs to be filled.

Daphne Gomez:
I have read… And I might get the specific statistics wrong, so don’t quote me on this. I’ve read something around the lines of, only 30% of women even negotiate their salaries when they go into a job offer, where men, I think, is closer to 50%, once again, don’t quote me on that. Have you seen in your experience that women struggle when it comes to this part of entering a corporate environment?

Katy McFee:
Yeah. I mean, anecdotally, I can say that men negotiate way more often than women. I have seen some women negotiate, but in terms of the comparison, both when it comes to starting salaries, to raises, and to promotions, men negotiate far more often. I saw a statistic, I think it was in a Harvard Business Review article that said that, “20% of women don’t negotiate at all, in their whole career. And that ends up costing them something like between $650,000 to over a million dollars over the course of their career, because they’re just not comfortable negotiating.”

Daphne Gomez:
Why is it that you think so many women struggle when it comes to being confident when it comes to the negotiation process? And why are you so passionate about this?

Katy McFee:
Good question. I mean, I’ve been passionate about this for a long time. One, because I’ve observed women not negotiating. Two, probably… Oh, at least a decade ago… About a decade ago, I read Lean In, which I resonated with a lot, and it brought up this topic. It brought this topic to mind to me for the first time. I had seen it, but I had never really paid a lot of attention to this, the fact that women negotiate less than men. And thirdly, I was part of an organization called Women Powering Technology, and I was helping get that off the ground. We decided to host some workshops on various topics that we thought would be important to women. We did a couple of negotiation, and they sold out. They were just… They were so well attended. And it just became really clear to me that, women need this. A lot of women want some guidance, want to become more confident when it comes to negotiation.

Katy McFee:
In terms of why women struggle with it, there’s something called the likability backlash, that I think is really important to touch on. What that is, is a backlash that women face when they negotiate, that men don’t face.

Katy McFee:
When men negotiate their starting salary or a raise, they’re generally seen as assertive, and it’s seen almost in a positive light or a neutral light. When women negotiate, because we view women as being naturally collaborative, nurturing beings, we’re not expecting negotiation. And so, subconsciously, the… Sorry. Subconsciously, people like women less when they negotiate, unfortunately. And we’ve seen this again and again in studies and data. It’s a real thing that women have to worry about. I think what happens is that, when women negotiate, they sense that backlash, and so they feel less comfortable doing it, because as women we want to be liked, and we know that in business, likability is more important than competence, in terms of your success. There’s a lot of data… Lots of data to back that up. Of course, we want to be liked. We’re reluctant to negotiate for that reason.

Daphne Gomez:
There was a past podcast episode that I did with a therapist who actually touched on a point where it sounds very similar to what you just said. It’s called Human Giver Syndrome. She described teachers as being in this category, a profession of givers. In this environment, there’s givers, and then there’s, I think, humans or people. And the givers are the ones that are nurturing, they’re always in a position of supporting others, and helping others in whatever capacity they can. But at some point, if they ever start to ask for things, if they ever start to vocalize concerns, it is triggering for those who are humans or people, or just those who just get to live. They get to create, they get to be their own things.

Daphne Gomez:
And many times these pink collar jobs, which are primarily taken over by women, are in a position that when they start to voice concerns or they need to vocalize that they need something more, whether it’s financially, they need a little bit more, it can start to feel a little uncomfortable for them if they’ve never been able to do so in their past work, or if they’ve just never felt confident enough to even try it. It’s something that is, you do have to practice it and you do have to step outside of your comfort zone and do it once or twice, and then realize that it’s not the end of the world when you do it.

Daphne Gomez:
I’m so excited to get started and just hear a little bit of your best practices when it comes to negotiating even starting salary, with that first position that they get outside of the classroom. How would you recommend someone negotiate a salary, even if they don’t have, quote, unquote, “formal experience.” For example, a teacher who’s going into an SDR role or BDR role, and they get to the interview process, and it’s time for them to actually give a starting salary. What would you recommend they do there?

Katy McFee:
Good question. I think, if you don’t have formal experience, that’s okay. I think it’s important to remember that you have work experience. There’s a lot of value there that you’re bringing to the table. One of the things that I always bring up when talking about negotiation is, do your homework. And by that, I mean, research what the market rate is for a given position, and then use that in your negotiation. There are lots of websites out there that have salary information on them. I recommend looking at multiple sites so that you can get a good sample size. You could also ask around in your network if you know people who are either managing people that do this job, or if you know people who actually are doing the job itself, you can ask them what a reasonable salary range would look like.

Katy McFee:
And if the range is rather broad, you can get an idea of what you should be expecting based on things like geography, size of the company, funding situation of the company, and as well, your experience level. Let’s say for example… I don’t know, a BDR role has a range of 50 to 70K, I don’t even know. 50 to 70K, you could potentially ask on the higher end of that, because you have work experience under your belt. It’s within the range, but you can still ask on the higher end, even if you haven’t done that particular role before. I think it’s a matter of understanding what you’re bringing to the table, and being well prepared for that. We’ll talk a little bit about some of the techniques, but if you come well prepared and you’re confident in your ask, you’re going to be more likely to get what you’re looking for.

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. I think that’s something that’s really frustrating to teachers who are navigating this, because they’re coming from a position where they can look at a district salary schedule and they, no matter of factly, this is exactly what I’m going to make if I go to this school district. Human resources has it posted, but when it comes to looking at the different websites, I always recommend going into a Glassdoor because that’s at least very specific to the company. You can say, “I am applying for a project manager role at company X, Y, Z”, and you may be able to find a salary for that exact position, which is better than just that Google search of project manager salary, but more specific would be, project manager salary average, Los Angeles, is a little bit better of a Google search. Do you have other websites that you would recommend besides just a broad Google search or Glassdoor?

Katy McFee:
Salary.com is one, PayScale is another one. And often, I will just Google position, location, salary, and see what pops up. But I… There are others out there as well. And like I said, I also just like asking humans who might be able to give me an indication. I don’t always ask people their exact salary because that’s not always a comfortable thing to do, but you can ask what for the ranges. “Hey, I’m looking at moving into this type of position. What’s a reasonable range I can expect?”

Katy McFee:
Another thing is, if you’re working with a recruiter, you can often ask them what the range is, right up front. That’ll give you an idea of, whether or not the range is within… A job that you are willing to do. Because something to keep in mind is, if you’re coming from a job where you have a lot of experience and you’re moving to an entry level position, you will have to likely stay within a salary band. If it’s an entry level position and the salary band only goes up to $70,000, and you’re used to making a hundred, even if you’re the best candidate out there, they’re going to be bound by those… By that benchmarking of that role. And so, a recruiter will be able to give you an idea as to whether or not, the band is within your expectations.

Salary Negotiation and Raises with Katy McFee

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. I love that advice. For this audience, I have given the suggestion before, if they are open, because they’re in the middle of a career pivot, so they’re coming with less networking experience. And if they are open to taking an interview prior to even knowing the salary range, that interviewing experience in itself is great experience, where you’re practicing.

Katy McFee:
If the recruiter doesn’t ask a specific range or give you a specific range, go in through that process, and if you do get offered a position, and the range is too low, you can, one, try to negotiate to where you need to be, but two, you actually got your foot in the door at a company and you were able to impress them. And at the end of the day, you can say, “I’m so sorry. This just does not fit into what I am comfortable taking. However, in the future, if you have a new role that falls into this range, please reach out to me because I had such a wonderful time at your company.” And I know that, that can feel so disappointing, but when you are coming from a place where you don’t have a network of connections and new companies, that is a great strategy as well.

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah, absolutely. I often tell people that if you really want a job, don’t bring up salary rate at the beginning. That’s partly my personal bias, maybe. But I like to wait until I’m at the offer stage to start talking salary, because at that point they really want you, and they’re going to be more likely to come up a little bit. They don’t want to lose you over a couple of K, especially because, oftentimes, they’ve gone through a lot to find the candidate that they want. I typically say, wait. To your point, it’s excellent experience. You’re going to meet people, if you are able to establish a strong rapport with the hiring manager, and really, the only thing that’s not lining up is the salary. They might even point you to a friend of theirs, or another company, or another department. In my mind, it’s never a bad idea to go through that process.

Katy McFee:
And generally speaking, I think you can have a transparent conversation with people. If, let’s say, there’s a position that you really want, and the salary just isn’t lining up, you can also think about, “What else is important to me? Other than salary, do I care for more pay time off? Flexible working arrangements?”

Katy McFee:
I was speaking with someone recently, who said, “Hey, I think I’m going to negotiate getting a leadership coach into my offer”, because that was something that was important to her. She was able to successfully do that. You can think outside the box a little bit, as to what’s important to you. And if you’re moving into something like a sales role, there’s also the variable component that you can sometimes get a little more flexibility on. Sometimes it means taking a bit of a hit on the base salary, but they’re willing to be a bit more flexible on your bonus or on your variable. Lots of components that you can play with, to try and get a package that works for you.

Daphne Gomez:
I love that advice. And that’s always with that first thing that you said, you do your research and you know what’s a realistic expectation, because there are some roles that have that huge band, but there are some roles that they’re not going to negotiate $90,000 for a customer support position, most likely. If you’re looking at the roles that are entry level, then they may have a lower range and that’s just the realistic expectation. But those are also the types of roles that you can get your foot in the door at a company, and then take that experience to become the manager, the customer success manager, or the sales enablement trainer to help everybody. And the more you grow in the company, and the more experience you have, the more you’re able to leverage that experience. Have you ever heard of people who are taking roles and then after every couple of years, leaving for new companies to help them actually find higher salaries that way?

Katy McFee:
Oh, absolutely. Yeah. A couple things, one is, sometimes the company you’re joining has a growth plan within that company. I’ve seen that as well. And oftentimes, you can ask that, “What’s the opportunity for growth within this company? I’m really ambitious. There’s lots that I want to do.” And they’ll generally be pretty transparent about that, where, “Hey, we expect you to stay in this role for one year, but after that, if you’re doing great, there’s opportunities to move into other departments or positions.”

Katy McFee:
The other thing you can do, as you mentioned, is move to another company. Once you have a couple years of experience under your belt, you’re much more hireable, and that puts you in a better position to move on to another company. Part of the reason that I think negotiating your starting salary is so important, is that is one of the best times to increase your salary. When you’re going to a new company, you are in a position to create a new baseline for yourself in terms of what your salary is. You should never be going from one company to another, for the same pay. There should always be a nice little bump there. That’s a strategy that lots of people use, moving every two to three years, to get that salary bump, with each move. It can be pretty lucrative over time.

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. I have seen a former teacher, actually, someone I’m very close with, go from 65,000 to multiple six figures within four years time using this strategy, and continuing to grow in what she’s actually doing as far as her job duty go, but just constantly, even if she’s happy in a position, continuing to look for other opportunities, just because it is something that’s pretty common after you leave the classroom. People are leaving companies after a certain amount of years, two or three is probably the average, the longer you’re in the position, the better it… Clearly. But, at least, two years, so that you’re not leaving too soon.

Daphne Gomez:
Let’s talk a little bit about that first negotiation. The very first time they offer me… Let’s say, it is a position and they are willing to give me $65,000, which is close to what I feel like is a fair compensation. But, even if it’s more than I’m making as a teacher, I still probably should negotiate that salary, just because this is the first time I’m doing it. What would be your recommendation for a starting salary, $65,000? Do you have a formula that you use on how much you would actually negotiate on top of that?

Katy McFee:
I mean, I always go back to doing my homework. I look at what’s reasonable for that position. I never use my existing salary as part of that equation, unless, unless they’re offering me less than my existing salary. And then, I use it as leverage, and I say, “Mm, unfortunately I can’t take that kind of pay cut. How about this?” But in the case where, let’s say, they’re offering you 65,000, if the range that I’m seeing with my market research is 60 to 80, I’ll probably ask for 75 or 80, depending on the position and whether I feel that, that’s reasonable at my experience level and with the company that I’m applying to, but there’s never harm in negotiating. Typically, typically speaking, the offer that they’re providing you is probably not their top offer.

Daphne Gomez:
Oh yeah. No.

Katy McFee:
I’ve almost never seen a case… If I’ve counter back, and it’s within a reasonable range, they’re pretty much always going to say, yes. So, [crosstalk 00:20:38]-

Daphne Gomez:
I’ve negotiated about 10%, I think 14%, at one position, because I felt like that was a very safe bet. I was secretly happy with the offer that they gave me. I had done my homework and I knew that there was a potential that it could be a little bit higher, but I did 10, and I think 14% at one of them. And both of times, they said, yes.

Katy McFee:
I negotiated at one company, a 20% bump in my base, and they instantly accepted it. And then, I kicked myself, because I was reluctant. I thought 20% was a lot. And I was reluctant to ask for any more, but because they were so quick to accept it, I thought, “Ooh, I left some money on the table here.” But, that’s the tough thing with negotiating. You never really know how high they’re willing to go, and so you might leave money on the table. And at the same time, you want to ask for what’s reasonable.

Katy McFee:
It’s a matter of really understanding what you’re comfortable with, what offer you would be happy with, and then going from there. But to your point, I mean, asking for 10% more is very reasonable. It really is. If anything, they will… If they can’t do it, let’s say it’s outside of their budget, they’ll counter back. It’s not so far outside the realm that they’re going to walk away at that point. If anything, they’ll say, “Oh, well, I can’t quite do 10%, but I can do eight.” And then, you’re still 8% higher than you would’ve been.

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. And that’s a great question is, will they take away a job offer if I ask for something too high?

Katy McFee:
I haven’t ever seen someone just rescind a job offer without a conversation, and somebody asked for more. Now, I have seen a scenario where the salary range for the position was just so much lower than what the person wanted, that it didn’t make sense to continue the negotiation. And I can say this as a hiring manager as well, there was a position that I was trying to hire for… This is a couple of companies ago. And I believe the range we were looking at for a base was 80 to a hundred. And it also had a variable component, and it was a senior position, and we were a startup. And some candidates came in and said, “I need 200.” I would just say to them immediately, “Nah, I don’t think we’re going to get there”. Because the discrepancy was just so large that I didn’t want to waste their time. I just was very transparent up front and said, “This is my salary range, if that doesn’t work for you, then let’s just agree to part ways.”

Katy McFee:
That can happen, if the salary range is just so far off of what the candidate wants, but I’ve never seen an employer just ghost a candidate, like rescind the offer and not have a conversation. Typically, they’ll counter back or they’ll have a conversation explaining why they can’t meet that request.

Daphne Gomez:
And that’s also a great thing to think about is, I’ve talked about it in past episodes. Different companies are going to have different salaries depending on if they’re a startup company, depending if they’re a huge company with a lot of funding. If you went in a corporate training interview and they told you that the salary was $55,000 at one company, it depends on the scope of the work that you’re doing. Company B might be $85,000, depending on the scope that you’re doing and just depending on the budget. You really can’t have that mindset of, one company is always going to be the exact same funding, because these executive level or director level roles may pay multiple six figures at most other companies, depending on where they are with funding.

Katy McFee:
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. That’s why I mentioned the funding situation of the company is important. If they’ve just gotten an injection of VC funding and they’re really well funded, then they’re probably paying a much more competitive salary. One thing that people ask me a lot is, whether or not you should be the one to put up the first offer or have the company do so. And that’s another tough thing, because, again, you don’t want to leave money on the table, but a lot of people don’t feel comfortable making that first offer. That really comes to personal preference. But I have seen a stat that said that, “When the candidate made the first offer, they’re starting salary, what they ended up negotiating was 30% higher.” That would be a case for being the one to throw that first number.

Katy McFee:
And again, typically, companies are going to be transparent with you. If you say, “I’ve done some market research, it looks like, typically, a role like this will pay 80K, that’s in the range of what I’m looking for.” Or you can say, “The range I’ve seen is between 70 and 90, that’s within the range that I’m comfortable with, is that something that we can do?” Then typically, they’ll be transparent. They’ll either say, “Yeah, I think we can work within that.” Or, “You’re out to lunch. That’s not going to work”.

Daphne Gomez:
Once they eventually are in their new amazing roles, another thing that is new to former teacher world is, some companies have… Every six months, they do evaluations, every 12 months, they do evaluations, and they may have annual raises. How would you… Or how long would you, potentially stay in a new role before you asked for a raise?

Katy McFee:
Good question. Every company is different. Some companies will do annual increases on the anniversary of your hiring. Some will do it based on the calendar year. And some startup companies won’t do it at all. It is important to ask your manager what their process is, so that you can respect that. Typically, I would recommend completing your first year before asking for a raise. That gives you an opportunity to really show what you can do in the role. And most hiring managers… Because the first three to six months, honestly, is you just figuring out where the coffee is, figuring out how to do the role, you want to give enough time to really… For them to really see your performance before asking for a raise or a merit increase.

Katy McFee:
Typically, like I said, I would say ask, “Hey, what’s the process here for salary increases?” And that also lets you know, if they’re company that doesn’t do regular increases, you know that the onus is on you to go to your boss and ask for that, when appropriate. And in that case, I would say, one year out. I would wait for, probably, a year anniversary to my start date, and then I would approach my boss.

Daphne Gomez:
How would you come prepared for the raise discussion? What types of tips would you give for someone in that position?

Katy McFee:
Good question. As somebody who’s been on both sides of the table for that, I definitely have my opinions. I would say, again, come prepared, do your homework, but do your homework in terms of, what have you done in the last year. By that, I mean, what value have you brought to the company? How have you gone above and beyond? What additional response responsibility have you taken on? A big don’t to me, is coming with just a list of your day to day activities. And this has happened to me a few times where someone has come in and asked for a raise, and they said, “I’ve done this, I’ve done this.” And my response was, “That’s just your job description.”

Katy McFee:
You really want to come with some solid data that shows how you are bringing value to the company, and ideally, going above and beyond your typical job description. Another tip would be, make it an objective and data driven conversation. Don’t center the conversation around the fact that, your rent went up, or you broke up with your boyfriend and now you need to pay for your house on your own, or whatever it is. Those things might be true, and they actually might be the reason you want a raise, but you have to keep in mind that your boss will typically have to get approval for any salary increases.

Katy McFee:
You want to… What I say to people, when there’s something you want and it’s really all for you, give it to the person on a silver platter. Make it really easy for your manager to go get approval for this raise. And basing it on personal circumstance is not a great way to do that. The framework that I use for negotiation, is DFT. It’s do your homework, frame the ask, and that’s all about how you ask, which is particularly important for women. And the third is, time it right. For raises, that means, respect the process that your company follows, or wait a year, or whatever that is. But the important one here is the F, which is framing how you are going to ask for, either an increase, or your starting salary.

Katy McFee:
And that’s… Like I said, is important, particularly for women, because you’re trying to fight the likability backlash. There’s some things that you can do. One is, basing it on objective data, is obviously… I’ve mentioned that a couple of times, but it’s important and it helps. The second, is to use collaborative language. When you’re talking about what you’ve contributed to the company, you’re talking about the way you’ve helped your team, all of these types of themes, you want to continue contributing to the success of the company. These are all important things that you can do that will soften that ask a little bit. And it might seem silly to have to work that in, but it’s important.

Katy McFee:
Another thing to help curb this likability backlash, is using positive body language, positive emotion, so when you’re coming into your raise discussion… You know your boss already, instead of sitting down and making it a serious and negative conversation, sit down and say, “Hey Daphne, thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me about this today. I know you’re really busy, and this is really important to me. Hope you had a great weekend”, whatever it is. Open body language, positive emotion, and that’ll start the conversation off on the right foot. And they’ll remember, “Oh yeah, I like this person.” When it comes to time to talk about salary, it’s going to be a much more positive conversation. Those are a few things that you can do there.

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. I heard you say some great things and it… First, that I heard you say is, making sure that you are showing what you do above and beyond. It is almost the exact same advice that I would give when it comes to resumes, because so many people just write a resume of what their job duties are, of what a teacher does, or what a customer success manager does. What you want to do is show the results that came from you being in that position, like what types of value you bring. I always say, in the position you’re in right now, and then in your next position, keep a freaking Google doc, a bullet point of, “I just did this. I just did this. These are the things that I do above and beyond”, so that you can quickly rewrite a resume if you’re looking for a new company in two years, or when you come to this negotiation, and you start to ask for a raise, you have that clear data right there.

Daphne Gomez:
When you’re talking the different types of data that they can bring, I’ve seen something that’s really successful of being able to put numbers to it of, “I know that this is me asking for $10,000, or I know this is asking for $15,000, but what I can show you is I exceeded my quota for the last four quarters, I made that money”, and then sum. Or if you’re not in a sales role, specifically saying, “I created the onboarding resources, I onboarded 15 new hires, meaning that you didn’t have to hire someone for onboarding, even though that’s not necessarily my position, but you giving me this raise for these extra duties that I’ve taken on actually saves you money in the long run of having to hire someone else. Because you’ve seen that I’m able to take on some of your human resources training, the internal training processes. And I’d love to be able to continue to do that, but I’d love a fair amount of compensation if I keep adding to my plate, and keep going above and beyond in this role.”

Katy McFee:
Yeah, absolutely. I’m a big fan of quantifying things, whether it’s for sales or to your point, in any other role. Generally speaking, the higher up the chain you go when you’re talking with leaders, the more you want to focus on ROI. That’s a Sales 101 thing, but it actually makes sense in any area of business. To your point, the qualitative stuff is still great. And it’s super important, you want to bring that, but anytime you can quantify your achievements, it’s just so powerful because it allows that person to think, “Oh, the ROI on this person is really high.”

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. The return on investment, for anyone who hasn’t heard that term before, but it’s something that every business owner has to basically live on. If you’re able to show what you would do even in the future, “Hey, in the future, I’d even be more comfortable taking on even more of these responsibilities. And that would save you as we continue to scale as a company. That’s going to be, either a new position that you have to pay someone $70,000 for, or heck, I could take it on for the next six months until we get to that spot, and it would only cost you $20,000. And that’s saving you money for that type of work being done by someone. You don’t even have to train, I’m just more than happy to take on that new responsibility, or just continue with responsibilities I’ve already been taking to.”

Katy McFee:
And I mean, another thing that… Managers notice when people put up their hands and do more. There’s a lot of benefit to that. I would say that people on my team who I notice, put up their hand when something has to be done, whether it’s within their roles and responsibilities or outside of that, and in particularly, if it’s outside of that, people take notice of that and don’t want to lose those people.

Katy McFee:
Again, from the point of view of a hiring manager, when it comes to annual increases, typically, a hiring manager is given a pool of money to work with, and we have to divvy that up between the whole team. And the things that I typically think about are, when was the last time this person got a raise? How are they performing compared to the rest of the team? How is their pay compared to the rest of the team? Is it fair? And are they, either blowing it out of the water, or a flight risk, or both? And if they’re like… If they’re knocking it out of the park, and I think there might be a flight risk, they are right at the top of people that I want to make sure I’m compensating fairly, and giving as much as I possibly can to, so that they’ll stick around. That’s just some insight for people, as to what might be happening on other side.

Daphne Gomez:
Yeah. I have been offered a raise both times I left positions outside of the classroom, which is something that teachers are not used to, because admin, unfortunately, they don’t have control over it. It is a set schedule. They’re not able to offer compensation for even the top performing teachers. It was something that was a surprise to me as well, is when I was working in my first role and I decided to take another role at a different company that I was excited about. The very first thing that happened was, “What can we do to keep you, as far as compensation goes?” And that happened at the second time as well.

Daphne Gomez:
I think that we have covered so many amazing topics, and there are so many people who are probably dying to connect with you. Katy, where can my audience find you to learn more about what you are doing about helping women grow in leadership positions outside of, either the classroom, or just in their own corporate environments?

Katy McFee:
I’m on LinkedIn. Katy McFee on LinkedIn. I also have a website for my business. It’s insightstoactioncc.com. CC stands for coaching and consulting, insightstoactioncc.com. You can check out what I’m doing there. I’m also, probably, going to be hosting some negotiation workshops that people can sign up for if they’re interested and they’re going to be interactive, but yeah, you can check out. I have a blog post on there as well about negotiation. If you want to check it out and see a little bit more about what I’ve written, or if you want to connect with me on LinkedIn, I’m always happy to connect with new people.

Daphne Gomez:
Thank you so much for coming on and sharing all this great advice with the audience. It’s been really informative. And it’s just been great to get to know you.

Katy McFee:
Yeah. This has been a lot of fun. Thank you so much.

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