Rebecca Lonen Wheeler is a former middle and high school English teacher who left to pursue less stress and more work-life balance. She talks about her new role as a product listing specialist for an e-commerce business as well as her side business creating English resources for homeschool families.
Listen to the episode in the podcast player below, or find it on Apple Podcast or Spotify.
Teacher to Product Listing Specialist
Daphne:
Hi, Rebecca. Thank you so much for being here today.
Rebecca:
Thanks for having me.
Daphne:
Rebecca, do you mind sharing a little bit about what got you into teaching and your experience working in education?
Rebecca:
So my mom was a fifth grade teacher for many years, and so I had that experience of hearing her talk about her passion for elementary teaching. And she always tried to convince me to go into education, so I thought about it and decided elementary education was definitely not something I was interested in, but secondary education sounded really exciting to me. I’ve always liked to write, and so I went into college to be an English teacher based on that passion for writing, but also just because I’m really organized. I love to do everything in a very organized way. Even when I was a little kid, I have a younger brother, two years younger than me, I would set up little basically stations for him and have him doing things that I was creating for him. So definitely, I feel like it was part of my genetics a little bit to get into teaching.
So once I started teaching, I spent three years teaching seventh and eighth grade ELA. My second year actually was the pandemic, and so already before I even really knew what I was doing fully as a teacher, it takes a few years, I was thrown into online teaching. Ended up going through a couple of months of that. And then my third year, it was very chaotic. We were trying to teach in-person and then I also had students who were virtual at the same time. So I had a Google Meet running in some background. It was just a very stressful year. And so, that year was kind of the start of me feeling a little bit more uncertain of, is this something that I can do long-term?
And kind of based on that, I decided to move my fourth year of teaching, and with that move, I actually ended up teaching high school. So then I taught sophomore English at the high school that I graduated from. So I stayed there for two years. My fourth year of teaching was less chaotic than the pandemic teaching years. But it was obviously busy just trying to figure out a new grade level and a new school and everything like that. So, I decided to give it my fifth year, and then my fifth year was very calm, all things considered. But I just wasn’t enjoying it and I still felt very stressed, I felt very anxious. My mental health just wasn’t great. And at that point, I was dating my now fiance and I just noticed the impact that my stress had on him. And so, I guess I finally realized if I can’t enjoy this in my fifth year when all things considered, this is the best year of teaching for me, I don’t think I can do this longer.
And I didn’t want to be stressed all the time. I didn’t want that to impact my relationship with my boyfriend. And so even though a lot of people in my life were kind of saying, “You should just stick it out.” or, “I don’t understand why you don’t like this.” or, “You were always so passionate about this.”, I decided I needed to leave. And so, that’s when I started taking the teacher coach course. That was in the fall of my fifth year of teaching. So basically, I would say I decided pretty soon my fifth year, I’m going to be leaving sometime soon, hopefully at the end of my fifth year.
Daphne:
Were you kind of eyeballing other careers outside of the classroom for the years prior to that? Or did you just find these resources the second you were like, “I’m going all in. Oh shoot, here’s a course.”
Rebecca:
I’m kind of a multi-passionate person. It was very hard for me to pick a major in college, and so I’ve always kind of thought about different things. One year I was convinced I was going to go back and get a master’s in statistics or something completely opposite from my actual teaching career. So no, that was not the first time I had thought about leaving in general or just shaking it up entirely in a different way. But I didn’t have any particular career path in mind, no.
Daphne:
So, you started taking the Teacher Career Coach Course. And then after that, did you have specific types of jobs you were interested in or were you really still kind of applying to whatever popped up?
Rebecca:
I actually didn’t start applying quite then. I just kind of was thinking about things, listening to a lot of podcasts, talking to a lot of people in my life. I would say I was most interested in marketing, but honestly, the whole idea of doing my own business was really interesting to me as well. But obviously, you can’t just start that one month after you decide, “I’m going to have a business.” So yeah, probably marketing was the most interesting to me at that point.
Rebecca shares her experience taking a stepping stone job as a Product Listing Specialist
Daphne:
You ended up landing a role as a Product Listing Specialist. Do you mind sharing a little bit about this role and how you found it?
Rebecca:
I had a friend who used to teach math, and she was working at this company. She reached out to me when she heard that I was thinking about leaving education. She said that she had a position available in her department, so it really just kind of happened without me trying. Which is not to say that I hadn’t been actively searching and looking and preparing and things like that, but the actual role that I took, it was really just a connection that I had.
And so, it was easier than I thought it would be. It’s definitely not my forever job. It’s not my dream job, but for now it’s been a really good fit. I’m basically writing content for. . . This company is a large Amazon seller, and so I’m writing the content for the listings and working on optimizing the SEO for the actual listing content. And then putting them on Amazon. So, it definitely uses writing. It’s a lot more solitary than teaching. I’m definitely a very extroverted person, and so I think this experience has helped me realize in the future, I need something that’s a little bit more team oriented than just me working on my own primarily.
But it’s been a really good experience. I feel like I am getting a lot of energy back that I didn’t have while I was teaching. Just feel better physically, mentally, emotionally. I have more time to spend with my family, my friends. So I feel good about it, but it’s definitely not going to be my forever job.
Daphne:
And we talk about that in the course and we have a podcast episode all about stepping stone careers. You mentioned first thing, that the path you were really interested in was marketing. And this role, which sounds like there’s some pros and cons to it, sounds like heavily pros from the fact that you’re getting some more work-life balance. But also one of the pros is, it does sound like it is in the very specific path where you can use this to leverage yourself into a marketing role. Have you been kind of reevaluating that as a long-term career goal?
Rebecca:
Yes. Actually, I’ve thought about doing a master’s degree in marketing. I’ve definitely been narrowing it to something like that. I think another option that I’m considering is also something in communications, since that’s very closely connected to English. I have experience that’s a little bit more closely aligned. But I think honestly English and marketing have some overlap in terms of the communication and the persuasion elements. And I think any secondary teacher can relate to the persuasion element of you’re trying to convince kids to be awake and excited and learn something in the process as well.
Daphne:
Yeah, 100%. That SEO work that you’re doing right now could also be leveraged into learning SEO for content writing for long articles, blogs, and being able to, if you learn the tools of how to track and research SEO, that’s something that many places find really valuable. So, I would not knock this experience as just for nothing. It definitely sounds like this is a positive experience towards a long-term goal or finding some more clarity in what your next steps are going to be.
Rebecca:
For sure. Yeah, and one of the reasons I took this was because I didn’t want the unknown of basically seeing if I found something before the school year ended. And I just didn’t like that feeling when I switched schools. And so, I really wanted to know that I had something lined up. And so to spend the entire spring with that clarity of, “I have something lined up, I can start immediately after the school year.”, that was a huge factor in my decision.
I was planning a wedding in the spring. I mean, I still am, but it just wasn’t a great time to spend job searching and rewriting my resume for every role or doing that deep dive. And I definitely feel prepared to do that now in the next few years. But I don’t feel that pressure of, I feel stuck, I feel trapped in the classroom. So if I could do it all over again, I would do it exactly the same way because I am happy that I made that step. And I realized I needed to get out. This was my way of getting out, and it might not be perfect, but it’s definitely setting me up for something.
Daphne:
Yeah, sometimes ripping the bandaid off is the easiest way to just, “Okay, I left once and now that I did that.” Starting to have confidence like, “Oh, changing careers isn’t that hard and I can do it again.” But you’re not stuck on that teacher timeline of whether or not you’re going to break contract when you’re the most burned out or you’re only job searching on the weekends. And that’s even stretched really thin because of the workload.
Rebecca:
Yes, a hundred percent.
Rebecca explains what her day-to-day looks like as a Product Listing Specialist
Daphne:
Are there aspects of the role as a Product Listing Specialist that you enjoy? What does your day-to-day look like in that role?
Rebecca:
Yeah. So basically, I have different sets of projects. We use a management software, and so basically as projects are moving through the company, we track them using that. So, I just see what projects I’m assigned to and check in with my manager. And then I’m taking the current project and then taking data and then compiling it in Excel and then writing. I actually write the content in Excel as well. And then editing everything, changing my word choice, putting in all the keywords, and then actually uploading the products to Amazon.
Daphne:
Is this a remote position or do you work in-person?
Rebecca:
Hybrid. So I was hired in with one day a week from home, but I actually just got my second day, so now I’m two days a week from home, which is really nice to not have to go in every single day. So, I’m really enjoying that.
Daphne:
That’s awesome.
Did they ask you to do a series of tasks or what was the interview process like for this particular role?
Rebecca:
They didn’t, no. It was just a purely verbal interview.
Daphne:
What types of questions did they ask you for this role?
Rebecca:
A lot of the, I would say, more standard interview questions. Are you a big picture person or more detail oriented? I do remember talking about my experience selling things on Teacher Pay Teacher. I don’t remember how that came up, but I definitely did talk about SEO because I remember her saying during the interview, “Oh, you know what SEO is.” So, I definitely feel like my experience with that did help.
Daphne:
I’d love to talk a little bit more about your Teachers Pay Teachers story. And the reason why is because I know that you have created resources and you do have a side business. And this is one of the pieces that I think so many teachers, when they’re transitioning, they downplay some of their side hustles that are actually super relevant to the roles that they’re applying to. And in this particular position, you had a role that is almost identical to just listing products on Teachers Pay Teachers, which is something that you were already doing. Did you have this listed on your resume when you were applying for it?
Rebecca:
Yes. So I had it on my resume since. . . I’ve been doing this for a couple of years. But that was also one of the reasons why I wanted to leave the classroom, is because that’s something that I found a lot of joy in and I really love the creativity of it. And so basically being able to have more time gave me the chance to restart that creative process again. Because during the pandemic and everything, I kind of stepped away from it and didn’t have enough time or energy to work on the resources. So yes, I had it on the resume, but I’ve also since then, been able to have more time to spend on it, which has been amazing.
Daphne:
When you were talking to them in the interview, did it seem like they were more focused on that particular experience with some of their questions?
Rebecca:
I don’t think they focused too much on it. It honestly was not a super long interview, but I do think it would’ve helped if I had interviewed at other companies as well, just because I think it shows that I’ve taken initiative beyond what actually needed to be done in the classroom.
Daphne:
Yeah, we hear from so many teachers that have sales experience from before they were teaching. And they’re applying for these roles that are sales roles or sales adjacent, and they’re like, “Well, should I put that on there?” And it’s like, “Yes, you absolutely should put any experience that translates into the next thing.”
Rebecca discusses the challenges she faced during her transition
What did you feel like was the hardest part of transitioning outside of the classroom? Before you actually landed this position? Where were you struggling the most?
Rebecca:
I think the hardest part was when I was actually finishing out the school year, just feeling so overwhelmed with all of the different options, and not knowing exactly what I wanted to do. In crystal clear terms up to this point, it had been pretty straightforward of like, “Okay, I want to change my life. It’ll be like, I’ll get a different teaching position, or I’ll talk to my department head about something that’s bothering me.” But basically having so many different directions that I could go and feeling overwhelmed.
But that’s where the course really helped me to just get organized. Because I felt like I had so many things that were rattling around in my brain and I didn’t have a way to organize them. And so, I really love the Trello board. That really helped me a lot just to clarify, just put things in different places of, “Here’s where this goes.”, and start to sort through and make sense of, “Okay, what is it that I actually enjoy? What is it that I really want?”
And so working through the course materials was very helpful, especially, I don’t remember what module it was, but basically the sheet that said, “Break down your teaching salary. Here’s so many hours you’re actually spending.” I’ve always worked at private schools, and so we didn’t have a very extensive curriculum. And so I’ve always spent a lot of time outside of the classroom supplementing by making my own resources or finding stuff on Teachers Pay Teachers. And so, that exercise was super helpful for me to sit down and realize I’m actually not making that much per hour, when I actually factor in grading a hundred English essays or creating curriculum outside of school hours. And so, that was helpful to me to realize, “Okay, yes, even if I made exactly the same as I’m making now, I’m still going to be up money because I’m getting my time back. I’m getting my evenings back.”
Daphne:
And if you wanted to, you could supplement it with working on your teacher’s pay teacher store during that extra time or doing some other sort of part-time work, if you wanted to even go above and beyond. I feel like that was such a struggle with me too back when I started, which is why it was built into the course. It was kind of evaluating, people see careers in front of them, and we put so much value on, I think a little bit on what other people think also. Maybe I’m speaking for myself, but you’re shaking your head yes, of I want other people to be like, “Wow, what a clear, successful move she made.”, instead of, “Well, she went to school for this thing and now she’s taking this other job that’s the same pay.” You think too much about what other people’s opinion of it is.
And then you’re like, “Well, I’m not going to take this new job unless it’s something that’s on paper. I feel like I can brag about it.” And it gets in your head for a while, when you’re evaluating new careers, when what should be the most important is like, “Are you able to pay your bills? Are you happy? Do you see a clear path?” And also, “Are you able to hang out with your friends or see your loved ones or have these conversations?” Those should be the most important questions.
Rebecca:
Right. I agree a hundred percent. Yeah, that was kind of one of the things that helped, was talking to my boyfriend. And then also taking the course helped me to just realize, this can happen. I asked my, well now fiance, I asked him the other day and I said, “Do you think that I would’ve left the classroom, if I hadn’t have taken the course?” And he was like, “No, you wouldn’t have done that.” And so just to have that process of realizing, this can happen to me. And I don’t have to take everyone’s opinion into consideration, I just have to think through, “Does this make sense for me and for my situation?” Because ultimately, I’m the one who knows it the best. And even if people think that they understand, they really don’t.
Daphne:
And is it moving forward in the direction that you want to go? Because staying in the exact same spot and waiting until it’s perfect, until it’s a bigger leap sometimes means you never move at all. So, you were able to interview for this job towards the end of the school year. Did you have to break your teaching contract?
Rebecca:
I did not. So, I actually interviewed for the job, I want to say, in January already. And they asked me to start spring break, and I told them I was not comfortable with that. I really didn’t want to do that, just for a lot of reasons. And so I told them that wasn’t possible, and then they just gave me the job as soon as I was done with my teaching year.
Daphne:
That’s really lucky. And that’s really cool that the job held it for you like that. Are there different positions inside of that company that you’re learning about at the same time as you’re working in this exact position?
Rebecca:
Yeah. So, I guess I’m learning a lot just about overall the flow of business. There’s a marketing team, there’s a whole design team working on optimizing the photos for the listings. And basically working just to make sure that everything is as clear and concise and attractive in terms of the look of the listing as possible. So yeah, it’s been really exciting for me to just have these conversations with different people and get this glimpse into a whole different world that I didn’t know about when I was in the classroom.
Daphne:
Is there opportunities for you to move within the company into some of the other positions, if you were interested in it for the long term?
Rebecca:
I’m hoping so. They kind of suggested that when I was interviewing. I haven’t been there super long at this point, so I haven’t really poked around too much and asked too many questions about that. But I’m guessing that there would be.
Daphne:
Does it seem like some of your coworkers have been there for a while? Because usually companies, if someone’s been there for a long time, if you even look at their LinkedIn history, you can see like, “Oh, so-and-so bounced from this department to this department.”
Rebecca:
Yes. Actually one of the vice presidents, she started I believe, in my role and then became the manager. And now she’s the vice president of digital content.
Rebecca shares how she uses her side business to continue to grow her skillsets
Daphne:
And this sounds like it’s also a really good fit for you to learn about marketing in a way that it benefits your teachers’ pay teachers’ store. You can learn all the strategies and still implement those in your own side business.
Rebecca:
Yes. It’s been really interesting. Sometimes I’m typing away eight hours at work, and then I’ll come home and I’ll start doing my own listings for my Teachers Pay Teachers. But yes, I feel more confident now, and they’ve kind of both built on each other. They’re different obviously, because they’re different search engines, but the same concept applies for both of them. So yes, I definitely feel like it’s helped me to… Even just the process of going through working eight hours on just one thing has helped me to stay more focused in the evening and tell myself, “You did this all day today. You can do this for an hour for yourself now.” So yeah, it’s given me confidence.
Daphne:
Let’s talk a little bit about your teacher’s pay Teachers store, just in case there are people who are listening who are interested in checking it out. What types of resources do you create?
Rebecca:
So, I started my store in my second year of teaching, and it was basically just ELA resources in general. I started focusing on homeschool resources, I think because of something that I saw in the course actually on one of those sheets that talks about potential jobs. And that sounded interesting to me. I actually was homeschooled for part of my education as a child, and so I definitely have a place in my heart for the homeschooling community. And so to me, it seemed like a perfect opportunity to use my experience as a teacher, but then also go back to helping the community that I really enjoyed when I was a homeschool student myself.
So now I’ve kind of merged my store into… I have some general ELA resources, but I’m trying to focus it more on support resources for homeschool parents. When they reach a point where they’re like, “Oh, I don’t think I know this.”, or, “I don’t feel confident teaching this.”, my resources are there to support them with the things that they have questions about. So some of the more detailed things about writing or just to save them time and energy, honestly. I think the same thing applies for homeschool parents as it does for teachers. They have a lot going on, and so my goal is just to provide them things that can help them and make their lives easier.
Daphne:
Awesome. Thank you so much.
Rebecca tells Daphne what she learned about herself through the transition process
And Rebecca, before we wrap up, I’d love to ask you my favorite question to ask former teachers, and that is, what did you learn about yourself during this process?
Rebecca:
I guess I just learned that I’m capable of a lot more than I thought I was. And capable of learning and growing and developing my skills. And doing things that challenge me and feel really uncomfortable in the moment, knowing that they’re going to help me. And I’m able to overcome the difficulties in my life and succeed.
Daphne:
Well, I’m so grateful that you did. It sounds like you are moving in a really positive direction. And just congratulations on everything and looking forward to hearing what you do next.
Rebecca:
Thanks so much.
Mentioned in the episode:
- Our career path quiz at www.teachercareercoach.com/quiz
- Explore the course that has helped thousands of teachers successfully transition out of the classroom and into new careers: The Teacher Career Coach Course (If you are a Teacher Career Coach Course member, you can also sign up for our one-on-one Career Clarity calls.)
